[identity profile] htpcl.livejournal.com posting in [community profile] talkpolitics

Greetings, ma'fellow popcorn-munching scandal-consumers smart, reasonable, decent folks! Drat... this guy is everywhere! He has even somehow managed to populate my TV box - although I'm sitting here in the backward Balkans, thousands of miles away from the ridiculous circus that you guys call "US presidential primaries". As shocking as that may seem, Donald Trump is obviously hell-bent on becoming US president. For our American brethren, that may not sound so weird, but for many Europeans, frankly, it's unthinkable. A person without any political experience who's running for the highest post in the land, is boasting publicly about his wealth, and making fun of the painful experience of a war veteran - you may imagine how bewildered the Euros are about all this.

Just to put this into perspective, the most scandalous and ill-mouthed political person at the European political scene for the last few years has been some obscure finance minister who until recently was mostly famous for his leather jacket and his motorbike (yes, I'm speaking of Varoufakis). Even he was considered something unacceptable by the political elites at this side of the Pond, while Trump is currently heading the polls in the GOP primaries even after having spewed a shitload of crap. You can already hear a big "WTF" coming from Europe, can't you?

It's evident that us Euros and Americans perceive the qualities of their politicians quite differently. Trump is coming from the ranks of big business and passes for someone who has the "guts" to speak his mind (however stupid it may be) - he's a colorful, unusual, unconventional candidate - while Europeans prefer the more composed, calmer, more refined type of politicians.

As colorful a character as he may be, in Europe Trump is mostly known for his TV show, where he enjoys the privilege of being able to hire and fire people at will. When he made his announcement that he was running for president, people saw him descending upon the unwashed masses on his private elevator in his private skyscraper on the 5th Av. in New York. Yeah, we all saw that. It was yet another proof that he's an arrogant, self-centered asshole who perceives himself as a media darling - so he didn't spare his audience his spicy rhetoric this time, either. He has said he owns a Gucci boutique that costs more than Mitt Romney's entire wealth. But that was only the beginning. His shenanigans on Mexican immigration were by far more scandalous. ("They're rapists ... and I suppose there are some good people among them"). Thing is, the media does love people like him, because scandal sells. Big time. And Trump is a gold mine in that respect.

Granted, the media covers politics in a different way in America compared to Europe. There are two clearly defined camps in the US, so people with leftist or conservative convictions can just choose the info channel that suits their worldview better. A figure like Trump is enjoying so much success because he's a polarizing factor that the media love to either worship or hate. The European media, in contrast, largely share the same values and views, which is why their attitude to the likes of this clown is quite the same: very negative. And their audience, respectively, is shocked, shocked!, I tell you!, at the sight of someone who can afford to speak such grotesque monstrosities, and pass as a serious political figure in the meantime. It just doesn't compute. It grinds on our sensitive Euro ears.

In Europe, being politically inexperienced is much more unacceptable than it is in the US, where in certain circumstances that could even be an asset. Americans do love people who are not part of the establishment, which is why so many of them view Trump as a maverick, especially when comparing him to the likes of Hillary Clinton or Jeb Bush.

In other words, the "unpolitical politician" is a phenomenon that's almost unfamiliar in Europe. There *are* some populists like Le Pen and Tsipras, who get a lot of attention as persons, but their political programs tend to be viewed with suspicion. With Trump, things are looking rather differently.

The only politician who tried to behave somewhat similar to Trump's pattern in Europe that comes to mind is one Peer Steinbrueck, a Social-Democrat candidate in Germany who back in 2013 used a sharp tongue during an interview for a big German magazine. He even dared to flip the bird at the camera. That didn't go well with the public at all, who considered it too vulgar and immature. So, Steinbrueck was crushed at the election. We shall see how far this sort of behavior brings Trump in the race to the presidency.

(no subject)

Date: 23/7/15 18:25 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oportet.livejournal.com
I don't have a good guess on how this will turn out.

On one hand, big personality has won every presidential election I've been aware of in my lifetime - which is good for Trump, not so good for Jeb and Hillary.

On the other hand, there's been a Bush or a Clinton holding one of the top 3 offices for....around 97% of my life.

One streak must end...unless Trump goes indy and names George Clinton as his running mate!

(no subject)

Date: 23/7/15 19:49 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] policraticus.livejournal.com
As shocking as that may seem, Donald Trump is obviously hell-bent on becoming US president.

No. No, he's obviously not. He is hell-bent on remaining THE DONALD. That is all. This presidential run thing is just another stunt in a long line of stunts.

I will wager any amount of money, up to and including all the imaginary "billions" in Trump's "uuuuge" fortune against a shiny new Greek drachma that not only will he not become president, he won't actually win a single primary or command a single delegate. Well, maybe a single delegate.

Sorry to burst bubbles, but the Donald bubble is just that, a blip on the radar. Although, who can forget the juggernaut that was Herman Cain? Yep, that President Cain certainly has improved the country and.... oh, wait....
Edited Date: 23/7/15 19:49 (UTC)

(no subject)

Date: 24/7/15 08:29 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] johnny9fingers.livejournal.com
We all love to make wagers: however not all of us have political positions which oblige us to put our money on donkeys...especially when the course is a Steeplechase.

"But in the long run..." as Keynes said...

(no subject)

Date: 24/7/15 13:50 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] badlydrawnjeff.livejournal.com
I'm still waiting for one person to pay up from losing her wager on the midterms last year.

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Date: 24/7/15 15:39 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] policraticus.livejournal.com
Well, I have no trouble putting a marker down on this one. Frankly, I think it is less than even money that he even competes in NH this February.

Now, Trump as a stalking horse for Clinton? That is a believable argument.

(no subject)

Date: 26/7/15 14:15 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] yes-justice.livejournal.com
He is hell-bent on remaining THE DONALD. That is all. This presidential run thing is just another stunt in a long line of stunts.

If he can be an effective foil for the GoP in the process, all the better.

(no subject)

Date: 24/7/15 02:13 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] cindyanne1.livejournal.com
It will be interesting to see how it all pans out.

I don't think Trump is Presidential at all.

However, I've decided that I don't care who wins this next election, just as long as they don't make things worse.

(no subject)

Date: 24/7/15 06:20 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] airiefairie.livejournal.com
The thing is, you cannot know for sure in advance if a candidate would make things worse until they are elected. But you could judge by the things they say and the positions they put in their program, and predict roughly how their work in office would look like.

Whether someone who treats most Mexican immigrants as criminals, who disrespects the war veterans, and who treats his colleagues from his own party like scum, has a place in the White House or not, is up to every single voter - including yourself.

(no subject)

Date: 24/7/15 18:27 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sandwichwarrior.livejournal.com
You say that European's don't understand the appeal of Trump, and yet Silvio Berlusconi got re-elected how many times? He may be crazy, but we like him because he fights.

(no subject)

Date: 24/7/15 19:38 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] abomvubuso.livejournal.com
Silvio got re-elected because Italians do like their bunga-bunga. Same reason Hollande's ratings hit through the ceiling the moment he cheated on his wife with another woman. You know those French.

(no subject)

Date: 24/7/15 20:04 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] johnny9fingers.livejournal.com
And with an icon of René too...

(no subject)

Date: 25/7/15 13:00 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] johnny9fingers.livejournal.com
Makes me think that if only I'd been French I could possibly have sustained a political career...BTW do other people's wives count too?

(no subject)

Date: 25/7/15 14:35 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sandwichwarrior.livejournal.com
...and Americans like their Id.

ETA
Trump is an arrogant blowhard who says and does says the all that crap that we think about but are too polite to actually follow through on. I guess that makes him the american equivalent of a Italian man who sleeps around.
Edited Date: 25/7/15 17:36 (UTC)

(no subject)

Date: 26/7/15 09:54 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] abomvubuso.livejournal.com
Does it make him presidential material, though? I mean, if you behave in a way that creates enemies everywhere, how would you be able to pass your policies without support from anywhere?

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Date: 24/7/15 19:44 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] luzribeiro.livejournal.com
You know who else liked to fight?

Hitler.

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Date: 25/7/15 01:18 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] unnamed525.livejournal.com
Stalin, too. Also, Mao and Pot!

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Date: 25/7/15 13:00 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] johnny9fingers.livejournal.com
And Hulk Hogan.

This

Date: 24/7/15 22:25 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] danieldemarko.livejournal.com
guy is so stupid that he is shame of America. He would be bankrupt by now, if his father wasn't so fuc#ing rich. He behave as monkey suddenly escaped from the zoo. He looks ridiculous, like clown. I think that most of the time is high.

RE: This

Date: 25/7/15 06:03 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] luzribeiro.livejournal.com
Right, comrade!

I think that most of the time is high

But then again, who among them isn't.

(no subject)

Date: 25/7/15 06:08 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] nairiporter.livejournal.com
Everyone likes to have a clown around - for a time. Even though he appears to be leading in the polls, when push comes to shove, his campaign will disintegrate like a sand castle in the wind. It is all an illusion, and only the most gullible genuinely believe that he is a viable candidate who "has the "guts" to speak his mind".

(no subject)

Date: 28/7/15 02:02 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] anfalicious.livejournal.com
I've heard it put by several serious commentators in several serious outlets that Trump is just crazying up the waters to make the rest of them look electable. Coincidentally, one of them is good friends with Varoufakis :P

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